#and getting gemma's name wrong...

[whoviandoodler]

the restaurant scene my god. that brief moment when mark shared a real laugh and a close moment with helena despite just meeting her and then recoiled in confusion and shook his head. his manner and the look in his eyes by the end of that interaction when he shoved down the inexplicable, split-second slip into easy companionship and looked at her like the destructive, dangerous stranger she is to him. the stark difference between omark and imark in that scene; down at lumon, mark was the naif, the child, the fumbling one; outside the severed floor, helena took that role. next to a regular adult she looks like the sheltered woman she is, deprived of all the usual experiences that shape a person; in so many ways, she herself is as much of an innie as helly is, but unlike helly who can evolve, helena will always be waking up on that table, over and over, no matter how much she tries to convince herself having memories makes her immune to an amorphous existence.

[consultingfujoshi]

so if cold harbour actually has helly's ID number and helly is gonna be the one to find the testing floor not mark then I think they genuinely want her down there i think it was always intended for helena to take gemma's place once the severance procedure is "perfected" with cold harbour. after all lumon wouldn't want to present some random woman no one knows of as the example of a perfect human, and how would they explain where she came from, anyway? no, they need it to be helena, they need it to be an eagan, to further the mythology of the lineage and continue pushing the narrative of them being the chosen people who will save the world. in the end gemma's suffering will have been for nothing, no one will remember her name or what she gave for the supposed future of humanity, helena and the eagans will be the ones to take all the credit. just another layer of jame taking cobel's innovation for his own and burying her name and contributions. because the illusion of a better brighter future is always built upon the labour of less fortunate and often marginalised people whilst the rich, powerful, influential, often white people who facilitated that suffering hold themselves up as the heroes

[eheu]

everyone’s clowning on Helena at the diner but the way I would be so down bad for her in that scenario

[greentea-and-honey]

MOOT DID YOU WATCH THE FINALE

yah and im having a normal one about it!!! im very measured about the media i consume. now if youll excuse me im going to go stare at my ceiling disassociate and listen to radiohead for as long as my psyche can physically handle

[demadogs]

i want a melissa/shauna sex scene but melissa keeps switching to jackie like when nat kept switching to lottie in edible complex or like this scene from last night in soho

[iamnotyetoliverstarksgirlfriend]

Day #161

I am not yet Oliver Starks girlfriend.

[boasamishipper]

sooooooooooooo many things to scream about tonight but number one on the list is the difference in the ways dylan and mark's outies talked to their innies. from the get-go mark scout is nothing but patronizing to mark s. he created mark s as an escape from his grief, and now he wants to use mark s as a means to an end to save his wife and pick up his life where he abandoned it. he gets helly's name wrong and calls her 'the person you're seeing' because he doesn't recognize mark s's humanity. he sees mark s as an extension of himself, and he only loves gemma, so of course whatever mark s feels for helly can't be real or worth fighting for. and when mark s understandably doesn't see it his way, mark scout lashes out, calling mark s a child.

but then you have the letter dylan george wrote to dylan g. in three paragraphs dylan george talks to his innie like an adult, like they are peers. he's angry at dylan g, but at the same time, he understands why dylan g did what he did. he would have done the same if he were in dylan g's place. after years of being jealous of his outie, dylan g learns that his outie thinks he (dylan g) is the one to emulate, the self-assured badass. and where helena and mark scout made their innie's decisions for them ("i am a person. you are not.") dylan george breaks the cycle: he offers his opinion, but ultimately puts the decision back in dylan g's hands.

at the end of this season, dylan g is gifted agency. and after fulfilling his purpose, mark s steals his agency back.

[whoreiorcats]

my ideal love scatter plot. mark and helena have sex during the ortbo and when hellys back shes like wtf i didn't like you like that at all bro

It would’ve been much juicier for Helly to fall for Miss Casey. She’d be in love with the woman that her own outie’s company is torturing/exploiting, then find out that Miss Casey’s outie is Mark’s outie’s wife, then help rescue her even though she’ll lose her girl..... like come on

[queenerdloser]

that mark (very recently!) was so fucking pissed about helena using the wrong name for gemma that he went to immediately do experimental brain surgery as a giant fuck you and then DIDN'T anticipate his innie self getting pissed when he got helly's name wrong really underlines how much mark doesn't think his innie loves helly and also doesn't consider his innie to actually be him at all.

[mychapel-004]

outie mark getting shady when helena called gemma by the wrong name in that fuckass chinese restaraunt and then turning around and calling the love of mark s' shitty loser life "helleny".... i fear you got what was coming to you i would have malicious complaince'd my way through this bullshit save-your-wife plan too

[sageshouldknowbetter]

It’s tempting to think that innies are just the outies at their core, right? That they’re what you get when you take a person and peel away all their past trauma until you get to their very soul. The true essence. The self free from expectations. “The you you are.”

But we have to remember: innies can’t be the “true” outies without the environmental influence to “mess them up,” because the severed floor is NOT a non-environment. This world that the innies are born into forms their every character trait and idiosyncrasy that isn’t already BURIED in the outie’s subconscious. So though it’s fun (and not completely wrong!) to say innies are outies without the baggage… they aren’t the outies in their “purest forms” either.

Take Mark, for example. On the surface, the Mark S we see at the beginning of season one is a hard-working, kind, and seemingly content yes-man. Mark Scout, meanwhile, is a depressed and sarcastic alcoholic who gets drunk at night and sobs in his car the next morning.

The apparent difference between them? Mark Scout remembers his wife dying in a car crash and Mark S… doesn’t. Therefore, Mark S must be basically like Mark Scout was before Gemma died. … Right???

Not exactly. Because Mark S still has a past. A short one, sure, and closed-off too — but still a past, and it highly affects his personality today.

It’s heavily implied that he didn’t start off as the corporate tool we see in early episodes. In fact, based on his account of threatening to kill Petey and extensive references to past torture (“bad soap,” “Milchick can’t always be nice like that,” and “It’s easier for you both if he knows which end to start from”), he could’ve been almost as rebellious as Helly. The difference is that where Mark Scout remembers being formed by a drunk father, screeching tires, and policemen at the door, Mark S remembers days on end in the Break Room, saying he was a blight on humanity until he believed it was true.

That’s a decent portion of why he comes across as a “sweet” yet timid bootlicker! Because he is built on trauma! Just new trauma! Different trauma! Trauma he remembers, but Mark Scout doesn’t! (His outie’s past still impacts his character, sure, but it’s not at the forefront of his mind the way his conscious memories are.) The fact that his bad experiences are novel, weird, and surface-level innocuous don’t make them any less potent or formative to the kind of person he is now.

In the same way, I don’t think it’s exactly right to call Helly “what Helena would’ve been like if she was free from Lumon and the pressure of being an Eagan.”

Yeah — in some ways, it’s true. Helly doesn’t have to worry about public opinion, the weight of her name, or what her father thinks. She can have friends and a surrogate dad and, well, baby goats. But the difference between Helly and Helena is more than just one remembering her Eagan upbringing and the other not. The severed floor is in NO way some controlled, pressure-free, unable-to-change-its-inhabitants environment.

Helly remembers cutting her arm in a smashed-open window under red glow, apologizing in the Break Room over a thousand times, and learning just how much she isn’t considered a person. But she also remembers three other people being her only allies, friends (and lover), and entire world — literally. Less than ten people, and always under horrific circumstances, are the only people she ever sees. This kind of life could NOT happen to anyone on the outside, including Helena — even if she wasn’t born an Eagan.

So what would Helena be like if she wasn’t an Eagan? The truth is… we don’t know. But the question isn’t what she would be like. It’s if, stripped of her heritage, it would even still be her in the first place.

Your brain is split in half. Is that still you? You are awakened, memories gone, born again into a whole different kind of world, and grow to fill it like water in cupped hands. Is it still you now? Are you the same “you” you were ten years ago? Ten months ago? This morning? Who ARE you? And what IS “you,” anyway?

That’s what Severance wants us to ponder. And whatever the relationship between innies and outies is (the same person, completely different people, Cain and Abel, you in another lifetime) (can you even call that “you”?), one thing’s for certain: innies aren’t just outies with the bad stuff wiped off. If anything, that’s what Lumon would like them to think.

[david-lanndlord]

Okay but Cold Harbour is the episode that really, truly, fully humanized the innies - all of them, but none more so than Mark S. Let me digress.

I was so goddamn excited when iMark and oMark started talking with the camcorder, and it was so clear that iMark was incredibly touched at the start, that his outie had been thinking about him, wanted to talk to him, apologized to him. But oMark fucked up BAD the moment he belittled iMark's relationship with Helly and got her name wrong. It mirrored Helena getting Gemma's name wrong in the restaurant, and it was the same flavour of disrespect and disregard. oMark obviously isn't anywhere close to as malicious as Helena, but this scene made it extra clear that he doesn't see iMark as his full equal, and iMark realized it too.

So when the time came, it made perfect sense that he acted how he did. Mark nearly died, accidentally committed murder, and more in the span of a few minutes. iMark rescued Gemma, saw her safely out the fire escape door, and in doing so discharged his duty to oMark. He was in an insane and impossible situation, somehow managed to accomplish his mission, and then once that was done, he stepped fully into his agency for the first time in his short life and made the choice HE wanted to make!!!

I completely and fully disagree with people saying that that choice didn't make any sense. Of course he and Helly don't know where they're going. Of course they don't know what they're doing. But they were ready for death, had had their final parting, and then iMark said no!

I felt horrible for Gemma, and I cannot begin to imagine how she would have felt seeing that - it absolutely broke my heart. But at the same time, I couldn't help but feel proud of iMark, in a way, because in that moment he stepped out of oMark's shadow and became his own person.

[illuminatedquill]

How are you watching this episode and then your immediate reaction is that Mark and Gemma did not have a good marriage.

SHE HAD A MISCARRIAGE. THEY WERE GOING THROUGH AN INSANELY TRAUMATIC EVENT.

They were suffering apart - Mark growing increasingly frustrated and concerned because of his inability to reach his wife and Gemma becoming distant and obsessed with finding ways to overcome their infertility issues - but they still loved each other! They were still together through it all!

And my God - my heart breaks for Gemma even more in this episode. She is so fucking resilient through this hell and desperate to see Mark again. SHE’S ALIVE AND REMEMBERS HIM AND WANTS TO GO HOME.

The lie that creep doctor told her about Mark having moved on and then saying that “maybe she has too, and he’s seen it” - I need him to be boiled in a vat of acid. Gemma’s stoic facade breaking just for a moment, denying it but you can see the doubt creep in. Only us, the audience, knows that is an absolute lie and that Mark never moved on.

Gemma making a run for it, almost making it out only to be thwarted by the damn severance chip in her head. Her breaking down in the elevator, realizing she’s stuck in this hell transitioning to the shot of Mark seeing the police outside his door as he’s slowly swallowed into the darkness. Incredible.

What is Lumon doing to her? What the hell is with all these rooms. Did Dichen get a sense of deja vu as she read the script and realized they were essentially having her do Dollhouse again, LOL. We still don’t know how they got a hold of her. Did she agree to some scientific procedure that would resolve her infertility issues? Oh, Gemma. She made a deal with the devil it seems.

Dichen finally being able to show her acting range at last. Engrave her name on an Emmy right fucking now.

I want to be happy that all the people saying that Gemma is definitely dead or comatose and doesn’t remember Mark at all (or that she loves him) are wrong but I’m certain that Lumon didn’t take her escape attempt lightly. What punishment they gave to her . . .

Mark, YOU NEED TO LOCK IN NOW MORE THAN EVER. GET HER OUT.

There’s so much more I want to say but ahhhhhh, I need to sleep.

[hexedgelphie]

outie mark getting helly’s name wrong.

outie mark saying he got thousands of days with his wife not a clue how devastating it would be for innie mark to hear everything he can’t have in his life.

outie mark never taking an interest in his innie’s life.

innie mark led gemma out of the prison but screwed over the man who incarcerated him in the first place while running away with the woman who was also handed half a life with an end date.

Innie Mark hero idgaf.

[maatdraws]

Idk, i wanna take this out of my system.

I think love does transcend severance. And it does for Gemma. Gemma always loved Mark, and in their relationship ( in that last moment, when she goes to the party) she loves him 100% and still loves him 100% after those 2 years, (Asking when is she's going to see him, calling his name) that's why the 25th Cold Harbor Innie follows him, trusted him, that's why the barrier is not holding. That's why Miss Casey is drawn to him, and why she just follows him out to the exit and trust him all together. Cause Gemma LOVES MARK SO MUCH. And that happen even without any reintregration. That happen with her brain being severed 25th time !

But... Not Mark, not as much. Cause don't get me wrong, he does love her, the love he has for her is just not strong enough to break through. Their couple was already starting to downfall on his part, he let her go to that party alone, didn't respond "love you" back, he was just not... into the relationship anymore. And still is not.

This moment is so weird to me, but maybe i'm just reading too much, but why isn't he just saying " We were in love." "We were so happy." or anything in those lines, he just hesitates and goes for "We had a life together." makes it so much blank in a way ? But Maybe that's just me.

Mark is having his reintegration going, running around with a hole in his head, and in a very stressfull moment with his wife SCREAMING HIS NAME, crying, begging, slammin that door, being in such distress right in front of him... and all of this can't reach him, after all he did to get her out of here ???

Once Helly appears, Mark S love ignites, drowning that sense of duty he had for his outie, and the most powerful love wins.

That's it.

Mark Scout doesn't love Gemma as much as she loves him.

Mark Scout doesn't love Gemma as much as Mark S loves Helly.

Love transcends Severance.

I love MarkHelly as much as I love MarkGemma, but in very different way and form. MarkGemma has it's own form of tragedy and MarkHelly ( with Helena) has this crazy dramatic taste. I can't wait to see where the shows goes with those themes

(cause whatever we can say about Severance, is still about love, in all forms and shapes (paternal love (Irving/Helly Jame/Helena), maternal love (Cobel & her mother), friendship (Dylan/Irving , Mark/Petey), siblings (Mark/Devon), families (the Eagans/The Scout), long term mariage (MarkGemma), first love (MarkHelly), true love etc etc))

[spaceofunknown]

I’ve been thinking about zufu and about Helena getting Gemma’s name wrong. I love the ambiguity there, we don’t know whether it’s by accident or on purpose. I think the most fucked up (and therefore my favourite) interpretation is that Helena is continuing to try to gauge how invested Mark is in his marriage. “Did you guys look happy in the wedding photo?” “I’m sorry if I’m distracting you from looking for your wife” - I think it goes deeper than jealousy, although jealousy is certainly a part of it. I think Helena knows about Gemma, and is trying to reconcile her affection for Mark with her complicity in his wife’s suffering. The easiest way to do that is to build a narrative in which Mark doesn’t care about Gemma anymore. This is easy to do with innie Mark, who reassures Helena that he felt nothing for Miss Casey, who is entirely focused on “Helly” whenever they’re together. But the minute she tries to flip that on outie Mark, he immediately stops flirting with her and becomes hostile. She doesn’t know that he knows Gemma is alive and a prisoner of Lumon, so she might have been expecting him to react in the way that innie Mark would have, just politely correct her and then brush it off. I think it’s possible that having a deeper understanding of Mark’s love for Gemma has increased the guilt that she was already feeling (if we take her words in the tent as genuine), and could have something to do with the look of dread on her face the very last time we saw her at the beginning of episode 9. I also think this would say so much about her psychology, that she is able (to an extent) to stomach any amount of suffering, whether that be her own, Helly’s, or any of the victims of Lumon, until it’s Mark who’s suffering.